Stefy Bull - Trainer/Manager/Promoter

Was managing and promoting always in the back of your mind as something you wanted to pursue when you were coming towards the of your boxing career, or was it at some point after retiring that you considered it?

It's not something I planned and was actually more of a natural progression. I did always plan on training fighters and I even did some training when I was still boxing myself. After the success of what we were doing with Jamie McDonnell, my gym ended up being full virtually over night. I ended up with several fighters, all of which needed a manager, so I ended up becoming a BBBoC licenced manager. I started managing these lads and the next progression was for me to apply for my promoter's licence as obviously these fighters I was now managing still needed to be promoted. It was either I risk getting into promoting, or these fighters would have ended up boxing on the road as opponents.

Would you say it's beneficial if a manager or promoter had a boxing career previously, because obviously you've dealt with a lot of managers and promoters as a fighter?

Yeah, definitely. After boxing for over 15 years as a professional fighter I've picked up a lot of contacts and built-up good relationships with managers and promoters. Of course, everyone in the boxing circle knew me as well, so the transition into managing and promoting was quite comfortable for me.

What are some of the things you take into consideration before deciding whether or not to sign a fighter up when they come to you?

First and foremost they have got to be good enough. I had a fighter recently who I didn't

re-sign because I believed he was too old. You can't just sign anybody as they've got to have something about them to be able to build on.

It's been this way for a very long time, but why is padding a record and hanging on to the '0' still so prevalent in the sport in this and age?

Well, I don't really believe in that way of doing things. I don't believe in kidding the public and padding a fighter's record with 20+ fights before finally sticking him in with someone who's good enough to beat him. I'm of the mindset that if a fighter is good enough, things can happen. An example I can give you is Gavin McDonnell, the reigning British super-batamweight champion and now ranked #1 in Europe. I've had him since day 1 and he was able to progress quickly. He won the British title in only 12 fights, not many have done that. Another young man who's a good example is Andrew Townend, the Central Area super-featherweight champion. In only his 9th pro fight he stepped up and boxed Rendall Munroe in a final eliminator for the English title, losing on points but doing very well against a much more experienced fighter. At the time, people thought the match was happening too soon for Townend and that I was mad for putting him in with Munroe. I believed that Munroe was slowing down and not the fighter he once was, while Townend was a top amateur and I've seen him sparring daily with Jamie McDonnell, so I could see how good he was. So in a nutshell, I believe that if they're good enough, get them in.

I think padding a record is very much the oldschool way of building a fighter. It's not being honest with the fighter or the public. I don't think it's anywhere near as prevalent as it once was anyway. In modern day boxing, especially in small hall shows, it's all about ticket sales. It's very hard in the current boxing climate to sell tickets. So when you've got a top amateur or a really good fighter getting in with the Peter Buckleys of the circuit every time, are the supporters really going to want to keep paying to see that? These paying supporters who are perhaps struggling to make ends meet, if they're paying £35 for a ticket, they want to see proper fights. It's as simple as that.

There is a big difference in the public profile of British boxers nowadays in comparison to the 80s and 90s. Why do you feel that is?

Well, boxing is changing very fast. Obviously back in the 80s in particular, there was lots of boxing on terrestrial tv and everyone got to see the fighters. There were loads of household names. If you sat in a pub and mentioned Scott Quiggs or Carl Frampton, the average Joe wouldn't know who you're talking about. Even if you mentioned Jamie McDonnell in a pub that wasn't in Doncaster, people might not know him and yet he's a world champion.

A big part of the issue is the fact that the average Joe can't afford subscriptions to Sky Sports or Box Nation, whereas back in the day everyone could see the fighters. Everybody knew Frank Bruno, everybody knew Henry Cooper, everybody knew Barry McGuigan. It's because there were 15 million viewers tuning in on national television.

There are a few quotes that you have made on your social networking pages that could be seen as harsh truths. One of them is "As a BBBofC licenced manager I would never tell a boxer false promises just to get his signature on a contract. The business is hard enough". I'm guessing from that quote you feel that there is a lot of manipulation in the sport? A lot of fighters are ultimately deceived and being sold false dreams?

In a lot of cases nowadays, I doubt that even trainers are telling fighters what they can and can't do. If you have an average boxer coming along who's hoping to sign with you, you can't be telling that kid that you're going to turn him into a World champion or even a British champion. It's irresponsible and you should be realistic. Tell them how the game works, how things are on small hall shows, the reality about selling tickets, and everything else. They've got to know what they're signing up for. When a fighter signs it's a legally binding contract, so they deserve to know the entirety of what it means.

"Boxers who can fight but can't do tickets will not get opportunities. Boxers who can't fight but can do tickets will have opportunity in abundance". A harsh truth about ability alone not being enough?

Yeah, it is. I've got a number of fighters in my gym who are just not popular and can't do tickets. They live in villages where the pub scene isn't what it was, so they're not even out socialising and making friends. So these fighters just can't sell tickets and that means they can't be in the home corner. A promoter doesn't want to match one of their ticket sellers against someone who can fight but who brings no financial deliverance to the table. If you've got one kid who's very raw but can do 100 tickets, his promoter is not going to want to stick him in with someone who can fight but can't sell tickets. That's just how it is, boxing is a shrewd business at all levels. It's such a shame, but if a fighter can't sell tickets, he's not going to have the luxury of being the home fighter where the promoter can pick from a variety of opponents. These fighters have to go on the road and sometimes can't get a fight even then because a promoter won't touch him due to the risk-reward element.

"There's nothing worse than pro boxers training without dates or direction". An indication of just how important structure and stability is outside the ring, Stefy?

Yeah, you have fighters up and down the country who are training, or are supposed to be training, and they've just got no motivation due to having no dates or fights on the horizon. In other cases, you have fighters signing up with managers that don't do promoting, so the fighters have no opportunities. Whereas with myself, I have a contract with Doncaster Dome, I do 4-5 shows a year and I've got my dates a year upfront, so my fighters always have that sense of direction. They know all the dates I've got a year in advance, so they can plan their holidays or tell me where they're going to be at, when they're going to be training for fights and there's a structure there.

Any advice to anyone who might be contemplating going into managing and promoting?

I hope they've got a lot of patience, a lot of money and I hope they know the boxing game inside out.

What might be one of the bigget misconceptions amongst casual fans about the sport?

I think what a lot of people don't understand is that boxing is an absolute business. The only time it's a sport is when the events happen on the night. Behind the scenes it's business and politics galore. Case in point, the average fan might want to see fights like Quigg v Frampton, but these fights are more than likely never going to happen. Everyone would be interested in the fight, but how is it going happen? Frank Warren would want it on his channel, while Eddie Hearn would want it on his. Everyone wants to see big fights happen, but the reality is that it's very difficult for them to happen if the fighters aren't boxing on the same tv channel or signed with the same promoter. That's something which casual fans don't understand. There are however some fights that can happen if promoters work together, but I don't know how many are willing to do that. I'm willing and I am actually doing it right now with Dennis Hobson - it's a joint promotion show coming up right now. I've had to make this happen in order for my fighter, Jason Cunningham, to have an opportunity to fight for the Commonwealth title.

Do you have any interests aside from boxing?

No, it's just boxing outside of my wife and children. I was a Man United season ticket holder a few years ago, but after getting into training, managing and promoter fighters, I just don't have the time anymore. I'm at the gym at 9 a.m. until 11 a.m. I come home for lunch, then I'm back in the gym at 6 p.m. until 8 p.m. Then I get home and am typically on the phone all night negotiating, making fights happen, sorting things out for training. You could say I've got a very special family who makes do with what I do. Boxing is the only thing I know.

Any final words or anything you'd like to add?

Thank you for your call and I hope people are reading.